Korg poly800(v1) vs Roland juno106

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Korg poly800(v1) vs Roland juno106

Postby ellaguru » Thu Jun 05, 2014 2:51 pm

hi
i got a juno 106, i like it. Recently i have the possibility to buy a very cheap poly 800; are they (and in what way) comparable in sound? i read the review on VSE, differnt synths are suggested to be compared (many junos...)...
How to edit its own parameters other than its interface? i read that it had not sysex capabilities...

thanks
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Re: Korg poly800(v1) vs Roland juno106

Postby ellaguru » Fri Jun 06, 2014 1:18 pm

bump
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Re: Korg poly800(v1) vs Roland juno106

Postby meatballfulton » Fri Jun 06, 2014 2:00 pm

The Poly 800 is one of those synths that you buy because it's so cheap you can't pass it up.

The P800 and 106 are often compared because they are both very basic analog polysynths...well, except the Poly 800 has digital oscillators and isn't truly polyphonic either.

Programming is by parameter. Other than filter cutoff (99 steps) most parameters have either 31 or 15 steps, some have less (osc detune has only 3 steps!). The actual programming is done by selecting a parameter from a list printed on the top panel, then entering a value. This is not as tedious as it sounds because there aren't very many parameters :? to set. The low step resolution can get annoying...you can't fine tune the LFO with only 15 rate steps!

There is only one filter for all voices so you either retrigger the filter EG only on the first note held or you retrigger it for every new note...both can sound pretty weird depending on what you are trying to play.

Super primitive MIDI implementation. There was an OS update that allowed sysex patch dumps, but no real time parameter control via sysex or CC is possible.
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Re: Korg poly800(v1) vs Roland juno106

Postby ellaguru » Fri Jun 06, 2014 10:08 pm

meatballfulton wrote:The Poly 800 is one of those synths that you buy because it's so cheap you can't pass it up.

i agree with that. This seems so cheap. The thing is, maybe better to wait for some serious other synth. I mean, damn, i played it some minutes and it sounds really low, while, compared to it, juno's volume almost breaks monitors! ...maybe it needs some peramp or compressor...
...other than that i like the sounds it produces...
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Re: Korg poly800(v1) vs Roland juno106

Postby max badwan » Sat Jun 07, 2014 2:33 am

as a bed for modding, the Poly 800 is excellent - the MoogSlayer mod gives you knobs for filter cutoff and res, all the way up to AtomaHawk, which is a system re-write, akin the the Kiwi3P, giving you sys-ex editing (and more). The one filter/paraphonic thing means its best used for staccato playing. I'd say go for it, it's sufficiently different to the Juno to warrant it, and it's highly moddable.
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Re: Korg poly800(v1) vs Roland juno106

Postby ranzee » Sat Jun 07, 2014 3:25 am

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the Poly 800 (and EX-800) don't produce Sawtooth waveforms - they instead use stepped square waves.

The Juno 106 is able to produce sawtooth waveforms.

To me that's a major difference.

Secondly the filter in the Juno is much, much, much better. The Poly 800 was "modelled" on the MS-20.

A lot of the attraction to the Poly800 vs the 106 was the 2 extra voices, and dualing them into 4. Although there isn't an easy way to detune them in this mode to make them sound more "analog". Roland got around this by adding that beautiful chorus effect - which I love.

Finally, I'd like to think that the envelope generators in the Roland are a little faster (bigger) - the Korg seems a little tight, and inflexible.

I'm not bashing Korg or Roland, or saying any is better as a whole (elements in part are better) - I own the Korg EX-800 and I don't own the Juno 106 - purely at the moment due to their insane prices. But a Juno is on my hit list to get.
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Re: Korg poly800(v1) vs Roland juno106

Postby max badwan » Sat Jun 07, 2014 3:47 am

ranzee wrote:Correct me if I'm wrong, but the Poly 800 (and EX-800) don't produce Sawtooth waveforms - they instead use stepped square waves.

The Juno 106 is able to produce sawtooth waveforms.

To me that's a major difference.

Secondly the filter in the Juno is much, much, much better. The Poly 800 was "modelled" on the MS-20.

A lot of the attraction to the Poly800 vs the 106 was the 2 extra voices, and dualing them into 4. Although there isn't an easy way to detune them in this mode to make them sound more "analog". Roland got around this by adding that beautiful chorus effect - which I love.

Finally, I'd like to think that the envelope generators in the Roland are a little faster (bigger) - the Korg seems a little tight, and inflexible.

I'm not bashing Korg or Roland, or saying any is better as a whole (elements in part are better) - I own the Korg EX-800 and I don't own the Juno 106 - purely at the moment due to their insane prices. But a Juno is on my hit list to get.


the DCOs on the Korg are additive square wave oscillators, so no true saw wave, and the Juno can also do PWM which is a big plus.
The filter on the Korg is not bad, it's just there's only one.
I think the EGs on the Juno are a bit faster, but the 6 step Korg EGs allow you to do a bit more with the contours.
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Re: Korg poly800(v1) vs Roland juno106

Postby ellaguru » Sat Jun 07, 2014 3:49 pm

i finally took it for 100€...
i tried the headphone out and it's highier than the "normal" output, that's strange...
other thing: when i was tried the Poly, i accidentally give it a little hit and the volume turned suddenly very low, near silence, both on headphone than normal outs...so i turned it off/on but still the volume stayed very very low...so i hit it again and it retourned normal as before...
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Re: Korg poly800(v1) vs Roland juno106

Postby c-level » Sun Jun 08, 2014 5:30 pm

meatballfulton wrote:The Poly 800 is one of those synths that you buy because it's so cheap you can't pass it up.


funny because i have both, and i bought the poly800 as an instant gratification synth when my juno's first voice chip died. i paid a bit much and will prob sell it for a minor loss when i move. they each have their own character. if you can wrap your head around one parameter editing the poly800 is a great budget synth. ive gotten some nice pad/semi organ sounding patches with it. as well as some neat chord progressions in the oscillator double/whole stacking mode... not my go-to but still inspiring in a challenging way....
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Re: Korg poly800(v1) vs Roland juno106

Postby ellaguru » Sun Jun 08, 2014 5:42 pm

c-level wrote:if you can wrap your head around one parameter editing the poly800 is a great budget synth. ive gotten some nice pad/semi organ sounding patches with it. as well as some neat chord progressions in the oscillator double/whole stacking mode... not my go-to but still inspiring in a challenging way....

i tried some rapid DCOs and VCF editings and i have to say that for that price is a real cool sound. the patch saving is very limited because you don't have any sort of user memory dedicated part, so you have to delete presets...the cassette's patch saving/loading is a solution, not that pratical way, but i think it's the way those machines went in the 80s...(and the juno has this system too, but i never used it due to the beauty of its original presets)
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Re: Korg poly800(v1) vs Roland juno106

Postby meatballfulton » Sun Jun 08, 2014 7:16 pm

Actually there are no presets on the P800. It dates back to when all patch memory in a synth could be overwritten. Korg stuck with this concept while Yamaha, Roland and others split patch memory into presets (ROM) and user banks (RAM). However, with the recent KingKorg finally succumbed to having non-overwritable presets.

You can use any audio recorder (like your DAW for instance) in place of a cassette recorder to save and load patches. It doesn't speed up the transfer of course.

As for max badwan's comment about modding it only ever made sense to me if you already owned (and loved) the P800. By the time you have gotten the Hawk mod installed you've invested enough in the P800 to simply buy a more modern synth with more features. I certainly wouldn't go buy myself another P800 so I could do the Hawk mod! your mileage may vary...
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Re: Korg poly800(v1) vs Roland juno106

Postby ellaguru » Sun Jun 08, 2014 10:39 pm

meatballfulton wrote:Actually there are no presets on the P800. It dates back to when all patch memory in a synth could be overwritten. Korg stuck with this concept while Yamaha, Roland and others split patch memory into presets (ROM) and user banks (RAM). However, with the recent KingKorg finally succumbed to having non-overwritable presets.

You can use any audio recorder (like your DAW for instance) in place of a cassette recorder to save and load patches. It doesn't speed up the transfer of course.


ah ok, that's a korg thing...anyway cool to know that you can do it also via a soft...

meatballfulton wrote:As for max badwan's comment about modding it only ever made sense to me if you already owned (and loved) the P800. By the time you have gotten the Hawk mod installed you've invested enough in the P800 to simply buy a more modern synth with more features. I certainly wouldn't go buy myself another P800 so I could do the Hawk mod! your mileage may vary...

i'll see for that, 'cause i think it's not a cheap mod and for the total price it should be better to look for another cool synth as you say...a poly61 for example
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Re: Korg poly800(v1) vs Roland juno106

Postby max badwan » Mon Jun 09, 2014 1:06 am

I definitely agree on the cost of the Hawk/Atomahawk upgrades, but MoogSlayer is a cheap, easy to do mod, as long as you're handy with a soldering iron, the cost of parts is likely under $10.00, and the mod should take less than one hour - definitely worth looking at.
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Re: Korg poly800(v1) vs Roland juno106

Postby ellaguru » Mon Jun 09, 2014 10:00 am

max badwan wrote:I definitely agree on the cost of the Hawk/Atomahawk upgrades, but MoogSlayer is a cheap, easy to do mod, as long as you're handy with a soldering iron, the cost of parts is likely under $10.00, and the mod should take less than one hour - definitely worth looking at.

that sounds cool and easy...that MoogSlayer is that mod with wich you can controll the VCF?
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Re: Korg poly800(v1) vs Roland juno106

Postby max badwan » Mon Jun 09, 2014 11:27 am

ellaguru wrote:
max badwan wrote:I definitely agree on the cost of the Hawk/Atomahawk upgrades, but MoogSlayer is a cheap, easy to do mod, as long as you're handy with a soldering iron, the cost of parts is likely under $10.00, and the mod should take less than one hour - definitely worth looking at.

that sounds cool and easy...that MoogSlayer is that mod with wich you can controll the VCF?

yes, it gives you real time control of VCF cutoff and res, you need (from memory) two pots, a couple of resistors, a soldering iron and a drill. The VCF will self-resonate as well.
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