EDIT found problem.Prophet-600 from Wine Country Sequential

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EDIT found problem.Prophet-600 from Wine Country Sequential

Postby parke02 » Sat Jun 23, 2007 3:52 am

EDIT: Found the problem. The pitch wheel isn't properly centered. I turned the prophet on and off and I'm hitting middle A now. NOw the problem is, if I use the pitch wheel and bring it back to the center, the pitch will be flat. I have to bring up the wheel a touch to get it back in pitch.

How hard is this to fix?

Btw, the pitch wheel doesn't have any spring action. Is it supposed to be this way?




I just received my Prophet-600 from Wine Country. Couple issues...

1) The OSC knobs don't match up with the painted numbers. Middle A is two octaves above "0" on the dial, which should coincide with the knob at the 6:00 clock position, 5 on the dial. Its reaching middle A around the 5:00 position. No big deal, but it would have been nice if the pots were adjusted so the numbers accurately represented the position of the knobs.

2) More importantly, it seems as the though the Prophet's tuning was not calibrated properly; it is noticeably flat. I'm supposed to use the Master Tune knob to tune the Prophet to another instrument, but with the knob turned all the way to the right, at the +5 position, the Prophet is still flat. The users guide says, "If no other instrument is in use, the Master Tune knob should be centered" which implies that the 0 position of the Master Tune knob should be very close to pitch of middle A. I'm having to turn the knob to +5 and I still can't reach middle A.

The Prophet has been warmed up for the last 40-50 minutes, and I've autotuned the prophet using the Tune button several times. The OSC frequency knobs are set 2 octaves above "0" at middle A.

I've uploaded a recording of middle "A" on the Prophet vs middle on a Wurlitzer sample. Prophet is played first. It's not the sample thats sharp; I tested with acoustic piano samples and my JX-8P.

http://eugenepark81.googlepages.com/prophet.wav

Is it possible for the Prophet to have gotten out of tune due to rough handling on it's way here? The box wasn't battered or anything and they did a great job packaging it safely (multiple layers of bubble wrap and foam peanuts). I'm pretty annoyed after having spent just about $1000 for what I was assured would be a Prophet-600 in just about the best condition I could find one in. The Prophet has a 45-day warranty so Wine Country will fix this for free, but I doubt they'll reimburse me for the shipping fee.

Is this something I can fix on my own pretty easily? Maybe I'm doing something wrong...

Eugene



I've already emailed Wine Country Sequential, but they won't be available to reply until Monday.
Last edited by parke02 on Sat Jun 23, 2007 4:06 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Maschinengeist » Sat Jun 23, 2007 3:57 am

Before you do anything, contact those useless morons AND sum 'em to fix it up. They are supposed to be pro, then they should act like pros and do the job right. plus you paid top bucks for crap job. Their responsability!

See why I hate them? Talk with member DJ Fetus, he's been screwed up the wazoo with those pricey incompetents.
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Postby mistercooper » Sat Jun 23, 2007 3:58 am

I haven't heard very good things aboug Wine Country as of yet. I'm sure theres a tuning pot inside the case, if you're comfortable with opening it up.
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Postby Maschinengeist » Sat Jun 23, 2007 4:00 am

Don't touch it: otherwise WCS will accuse you THAT you decalibrated it. They are scums, I'm telling you.
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Postby code green » Sat Jun 23, 2007 4:00 am

wait--i know it seems obvious but...have you checked that the pitch wheel is centered?
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Postby parke02 » Sat Jun 23, 2007 4:14 am

Found the problem. The pitch wheel is off... I turned the prophet on and off and I'm hitting middle A now. NOw the problem is, if I use the pitch wheel and bring it back to the center, the pitch will be flat. I have to bring up the wheel a touch to get it back in pitch.

How hard is this to fix?

Btw, the pitch wheel doesn't have any spring action. Is it supposed to be this way?
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Re: EDIT found problem.Prophet-600 from Wine Country Sequent

Postby Maschinengeist » Sat Jun 23, 2007 4:29 am

parke02 wrote:Is it possible for the Prophet to have gotten out of tune due to rough handling on it's way here? The box wasn't battered or anything and they did a great job packaging it safely (multiple layers of bubble wrap and foam peanuts). I'm pretty annoyed after having spent just about $1000 for what I was assured would be a Prophet-600 in just about the best condition I could find one in. The Prophet has a 45-day warranty so Wine Country will fix this for free, but I doubt they'll reimburse me for the shipping fee.


Very unlikely. Trimpots are not overly sensible unless they are worn-out. If it were so, they should have seen it pretty easily.

And sorry but I'd remind them that they are at fault. Not you. You bought something represented as best condition and it's not. It's not to you to fix it; it's their responsability. And I'd protest against the postage too. With what they charged and the misrepresentation and the flagrant sloppy jobs, they should pay back the shipping. Many companies to so, being in their warranty policy. They won't do zit for sure but press the button and go higher if you must. You pay for what? an half-working synth. Does it sound fair to you?

I run a tiny business and I've paid the shipping both way because of an unforeseen error of our part. We can't afford that to happen because we run on dimes & nickels. But hey, that's customers service. If I could, so they are.


Pitch bender: if I remember correctly, it's spring-mounted.
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Re: EDIT found problem.Prophet-600 from Wine Country Sequent

Postby parke02 » Sat Jun 23, 2007 4:50 am

Maschinengeist wrote:
parke02 wrote:Is it possible for the Prophet to have gotten out of tune due to rough handling on it's way here? The box wasn't battered or anything and they did a great job packaging it safely (multiple layers of bubble wrap and foam peanuts). I'm pretty annoyed after having spent just about $1000 for what I was assured would be a Prophet-600 in just about the best condition I could find one in. The Prophet has a 45-day warranty so Wine Country will fix this for free, but I doubt they'll reimburse me for the shipping fee.


Very unlikely. Trimpots are not overly sensible unless they are worn-out. If it were so, they should have seen it pretty easily.

And sorry but I'd remind them that they are at fault. Not you. You bought something represented as best condition and it's not. It's not to you to fix it; it's their responsability. And I'd protest against the postage too. With what they charged and the misrepresentation and the flagrant sloppy jobs, they should pay back the shipping. Many companies to so, being in their warranty policy. They won't do zit for sure but press the button and go higher if you must. You pay for what? an half-working synth. Does it sound fair to you?

I run a tiny business and I've paid the shipping both way because of an unforeseen error of our part. We can't afford that to happen because we run on dimes & nickels. But hey, that's customers service. If I could, so they are.


Pitch bender: if I remember correctly, it's spring-mounted.



Thanks for the advice. It turns out the pitch was calibrated properly, but the pitch wheel isn't seated properly. The middle notch, where the pitch wheel rests doesn't return the pitch back in tune. This seems like something that COULD have been damaged during shipping, but probably not. They say they thoroughly test and calibrate the Prophet, but probably nobody actually "played" it proper.

So once I've moved the pitch wheel after powering on the Prophet, the wheel then controls pitch... so I have to kind of feel my way to the correct pitch.

Any idea how I'd be able to fix this?

Eugene
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Postby micahjonhughes » Sat Jun 23, 2007 5:04 am

Since it's a Sequential everything runs through the microprocessor. Perhaps you need to reinitialize the pitch wheel, if this is possible on the Prophet 600. Is is something you can do on the Multitrak. There is a combination of buttons you press if the pitch wheel, when centered, does not give true pitch. It basicly retunes the pitch wheel.
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Postby dougt » Sat Jun 23, 2007 5:33 am

Eugene, my posts are being deleted here so I have answered you on Synthwerx -

http://www.synthwerx.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=1583
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Postby Jack Spider » Sat Jun 23, 2007 10:31 am

Doug - your postings are being deleted because you are banned. The Admin has confirmed last week that your account will be deleted and you will be IP blocked from VSE.

As you are reticent to observe the ban, all moderators will continue to delete your posts - this is the same treatment that any banned member who continues to post receives, so please refrain from posting on VSE. As far as I'm concerned, this matter is now closed and I am not entertaining any further correspondance from anyone on the matter.

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Postby sam » Sat Jun 23, 2007 11:08 am

Jack Spider wrote:Doug - your postings are being deleted because you are banned. The Admin has confirmed last week that your account will be deleted and you will be IP blocked from VSE.

As you are reticent to observe the ban, all moderators will continue to delete your posts - this is the same treatment that any banned member who continues to post receives, so please refrain from posting on VSE. As far as I'm concerned, this matter is now closed and I am not entertaining any further correspondance from anyone on the matter.

Anyone who wants to contact Doug can do so on SynthWerx - follow Doug's link, or the one I stickied in 'Off Topic'.


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Re: EDIT found problem.Prophet-600 from Wine Country Sequent

Postby Maschinengeist » Sat Jun 23, 2007 11:10 am

parke02 wrote:Thanks for the advice. It turns out the pitch was calibrated properly, but the pitch wheel isn't seated properly. The middle notch, where the pitch wheel rests doesn't return the pitch back in tune. This seems like something that COULD have been damaged during shipping, but probably not. They say they thoroughly test and calibrate the Prophet, but probably nobody actually "played" it proper.

So once I've moved the pitch wheel after powering on the Prophet, the wheel then controls pitch... so I have to kind of feel my way to the correct pitch.

Any idea how I'd be able to fix this?

Eugene


I'll try to contact my former business partner about this since he was the one who worked most extensively on the Pro600. Unfortunately, I can't work on every synths entering our shop. I hate that but that's the way it is.

The service manual should be available somewhere online. That could help you out greatly. What I know is that you must press RECORD + 3 to center the pitch wheel. It's possible that the tension screw is loose. But as told previously, I'm not the authority on the Pro600 wheel since I didn't work on it myself.

And no, if it was packed properly, there is about no chances that the wheel get damaged. But it is possible that it was damaged befor the shipping. It's not usual that that the wheel of a synth of that age is cracked or be a bit worn out.

Tell us how it goes
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Postby parke02 » Tue Jun 26, 2007 5:34 pm

Thanks everybody for the help. I really appreciate it.

micahjonhughes and Maschinengeist were riight. The pitch wheel needed to be recenter using the Record + 3 parameter.

Just so you guys know, I actually received an email and phone call from David at Wine Country Sequential on Saturday, which is awesome considering they aren't open on Saturdays.

So overall, I'm very happy with my purchase and would definitely recommend Wine Country Sequential for anybody looking for a Sequential synth in great condition.

One question though, is there any way to detect which chips are about to fail? I'd like to maybe order some spare voice or filter chips.
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Postby calyx93 » Tue Jun 26, 2007 7:53 pm

Just for the record - P600's pitch wheel isn't spring-centered.
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